PATS 2012 - Good Products, Great Fun, and Sad Realizations

A Tale of Two Shows

Last Sunday I made some time to visit the Pacific Astronomy and Telescope Show in Pasadena.  It's a yearly exposition of astronomy related vendors and clubs which claims to be "the largest and most exciting astronomy show on the west coast".  This was the second time I've checked it out, and can't say that it's either the largest, or most exciting astronomy show on the west coast, but it's a nice way to spend and afternoon and maybe find a deal or two from one of the vendors.

The show runs Saturday and Sunday; tickets at the door are $20.  I think last year I purchased in advance and received some discount. There is an exhibit hall with booths setup and a series of presentations in adjacent rooms.  The Pasadena convention center is pretty sizable, and the PATS is not really large enough to fill the entire space.  This year it was sharing the main exhibition hall with the Bride World Bride Expo. 

As I was walking towards the hall after purchasing my ticket, it was pretty easy to guess who was attending which event.  The people walking around with the Sky and Telescope bags, or with arms full of astro gear were here for the PATS.  Everyone else had copies of Bridal World or flowers.  Lots of flowers.

PATS was sharing with the Bridal Expo... the line is for the Expo.  There was no line to enter the PATS exhibits.

The Exhibition Hall

Everybody attending the show got a free issue of Sky and Telescope and a program upon entry.  I briefly glanced at the program schedule and did not see anything to interest me, so I headed straight to the exhibits.  This was only my second year, and I remember it being pretty small, but this year seemed even smaller.  According to the program there were 44 vendors, and they were arranged in four rows.

I did an initial walk through of the exhibit in about 15 minutes or so and even though it was not a huge show, it was very nice to be surrounded by like minded folks.  The booths ranged from the large and professional, to the small and volunteer.  It was not very crowded, which meant the venders were available to chat and spend some actual time with the attendees.

There was not really any specific thing I was looking for.  I thought that it would be nice to see some of the newer gear, talk to some of the organizations and clubs, and maybe find something for my telescope project.  If nothing else I figured it was a nice way to spend a Sunday afternoon.


The Big Names

As one would expect the three heavyweights in telescopes and accessories were on hand.  Meade had a large booth, spaciously appointed with selections of their current line.  They had mounts, SCT's and one 16" LightBridge to round things out.  This was the first time I had seen their convertible Alt-Az/GEM mount.  It seemed pretty solid and was presented in the Alt/Az dual scope configuration.  Pretty neat.

Meade Instruments

Right across the way was the smaller, but still impressive, Celestron booth.  They had a nice selection of their SCTs on GEMs, along with eyepieces and some educational items, such as microscopes and a very small/cheap newtonian.  You can see the little guy at the screen right end of the table in the pictures below.

Celestron.  Notice the little guy at the far end of the table.  A Newtonian Finder?

The FirstScope is a 76mm f4 reflector with a spherical mirror.  Immediately upon seeing it's diminutive size, I was launched into a several minute daydream of using it as a finder.  I suspect it would work, but it would be difficult to get the image into the 'correct' orientation.  Some people have no issue with the mental gymnastics required for non-correct image finders.  I, however, prefer to use finders that orient the sky the same as my un-aided eyes, so this dream was dashed.  

Around the corner, Tele Vue had a large, but sparse booth.  They only have so many telescopes in their line, and eyepieces don't take up much space.  It is pretty impressive to see a full set of Ethos, Nagler or Delos eyepieces though.  Speaking of which, there is still time to enter the the International Dark Skies Association Dark Sky Giveaway for a chance to win an entire set of Ethos eyepieces!

TeleVue - Home of the Eyepiece!

On the right side of the picture above you can see a gentleman pointing to a black case.  He's probably explaining to the other gentleman that you can use one telescope to collimate another!  This was the most interesting thing in the booth as far as I was concerned.  There was an artificial star stuck in the diagonal of one telescope, which was then pointed at and rigidly joined to a second you wanted to collimate.  The optics of the first scope made the star appear like it was very far away, far enough to use it to collimate or star test.  It was a clever idea and an interesting experiment in optics.


The Up and Comers

Aside from the bigger names, there were a few other telescope manufacturers.  PlaneWave and Williams Optics were there, showing two different approaches to astrophotography.  PlaneWave produces very well corrected, large aperture, exotic telescope designs mainly for non-visual use.

PlaneWave Instruments

Williams Optics sells smaller aperture refractors, also geared more towards astrophotography.  They produce very high-quality versions of a tried and true design with some higher tech innovations.  Both booths really showcased the quality of manufacturing from these smaller run shops.  Not to say that Meade or Celestron don't produce quality scopes, but the fit and finish from these two are difficult to beat.

Williams Optics

The REAL BIG Name

I spent a fair amount of time talking to the guy at the Thirty Meter Telescope (TMT) booth.  Observing is a part of the hobby I enjoy quite a bit, but I also have an interest in the science and technology of astronomy and this project has it all.  When complete, this will be the largest telescope ever produced.  Well, it might actually end up being the second largest, as the Europeans are working on a 39 meter scope.

The Thirty Meter Telescope Outreach Booth

It was fascinating to hear about the design of the scope, but also about some of the long term issues such a large telescope faces.  Many amateur astronomers are aware that the reflective coatings on mirrors degrade with time.  Often, mirrors are sent out for re-coating to restore their reflectivity.  To maintain the highest level of performance continuously, so that the massive investment can be best utilized, the TMT will be swapping out several mirror segments weekly for re-coating.  This will allow them to re-coat each of the 492 segments every two years.

After the first few minutes I was ready to donate to help the cause.  Turns out, they are not looking for donations, just doing general outreach.  Very cool.  If you love telescopes, the website is an interesting read.

The Vendors

Theoretically, all the booths were vendors, but there were only a few booths you could actually buy things from and take them home.  The two largest were Woodland Hills Camera & Telescope and Oceanside Photo & Telescope.  Both had nice booths with a wide selection of things to tempt the crowd.

Woodland Hills Camera & Telescope

OPT - Oceanside Photo & Telescope

Both offer special pricing, and no sales tax, at the show.  This makes almost everything at least 20% cheaper, so it's a nice time to buy.  If you don't feel comfortable deciding on your feet, they will honor the same deal if you call or visit their websites a few days after the show and mention PATS.  I found both crews to be very friendly and knowledgeable.

Among the vendors actually selling product was Howie Glatter.  He's an ex-hippie who now spends his time inventing and patenting useful things for telescopes, mainly in the area of collimation.  It was great fun to talk to him about his design and manufacturing process, and the merits of various types of collimation equipment and techniques.  He's very friendly and very knowledgable.  All his products were wonderfully machined, solid and well designed.

Howie Glatter, Inventor / Collimator

One of his products I had never seen before were nebula filters designed to fit over the eye lens of binoculars.  As soon as I saw this I was struck by the cleverness of the idea and his implementation.  Compared to the objective lens, the eye lens has much less area to cover, reducing price and weight.  To protect the delicate filter from eye gunk, he sandwiches it between two pieces of optical glass.  This allows you to clean them without worrying about scratching the coating.

Eye Lens Binocular Nebula Filters - Very cool idea

To affix the filters to the binoculars, he mounts them in a metal ring of various sizes.  By ordering a size the correct diameter for your binos, it can be held in place by the rubber eye guard.  You roll the cup down, place the filters over the eye lens and roll the eye guard back up holding the metal ring in place.  It's tricky to describe in words, but simple and easy when you see it in person.  If I were not planning on buying a new pair of binoculars in the semi-near future, I'd think about buying a set.

The Truth About 16" Scopes

As I was heading out, I saw that the Meade both was relatively empty and decided that I should really see what a 16" scope would be like to use.  I'm leaning towards this size, and I was hoping it would allow me to observe without a ladder or stool.  Sadly, I'm not so sure this would be the case.  

Me and a 16" LightBridge.  Notice they Eyepiece Height

One of the Meade reps was kind enough to take my photo next to the LightBridge pointed at Zenith.  I'm about 5' 6" tall, a bit under average for a male human, and there was a pretty wide gulf between my eye and the eyepiece.  There was another show attendee, slightly taller than average, who could walk right up to the scope and peer into the eyepiece... sigh.  I did not measure exactly, but I figure anything over 70 degrees would be a stretch for me on this 16" f4.5 scope.

So... what does this mean for my plans?  It means I have to think about them.  Observing at the zenith is uncomfortable anyway, so maybe it's not bad?  Perhaps a small box would not be too cumbersome?  Can I find an f4 mirror at a reasonable price?  Is a 15" a better size?  Would another structure offer a significantly lower eyepiece?  Are elevator shoes expensive?  There are a lot of questions to consider.  I'd love to hear your thoughts on the questions above, or about aperture vs. eyepiece height, or any experiences you have had observing with feet on, or off, the ground.  

The PATS Bounty

So I left the show with a lot of questions about my telescope design, but I also carried out some other things.  Before leaving I gave into the tempting opportunity to purchase a new finder scope.  I knew I wanted something larger than 50mm for my new scope and I was leaning towards an Orion ST 80, then I saw this great StellarVue 80mm finder.  

The StellarVue is an 80mm f3.75 achromat that comes complete with an erecting prism, helical focuser, and 23mm eyepiece with reticle.  It's roughly the same price as the 80mm f5 Orion with an erect image prism and 32mm plossl, both of which would provide about the same 3.9 deg TFOV.  

After some quick cell phone research and a few calculations I choose the StellarVue for two reasons.  First, it's shorter focal length means I can get an even wider 5.2 deg field of view with a 32mm plossl if I decide to upgrade it.  Second, it's just a bit over 50% of the weight of the Orion, which will help with any potential balance issues.

My Haul from the Show

You can see the finder, with mounting rings, in the picture above.  I thought the 50mm finder was large when I first got it, the 80mm is more like a small scope than a large finder.  It looks almost comical on the Orion XT8, but I think it will be much more proportional on my new scope.  The comical nature won't stop me from using it in the meantime though.

The extra aperture will be nice to hunt down some of the NGC objects and dimmer Messiers as I progress onto dimmer and more difficult objects.  The scope/finder should also provide nice views of the wide field objects like the Double Cluster, or the Coathanger.  I'm looking forward to sweeping it over the Milky Way under a dark sky!  As soon as I have a chance to try it out, I'll write up a review here.  That new moon can't come soon enough.

If you are in the Los Angeles area next year in September, I would suggest checking out PATS.  At the very least it's something to do between observing sessions!

My Current Eyepieces - A Lesson About Investing

A few weeks back I did a post about My Current Scopes.  I wanted to take stock of the two telescopes I have, share a bit about how and why I decided to buy them, and to ruminate about what each has to offer.  My goal was to help me get a better idea of what's important to me in a telescope by really thinking about my experiences to date, and to see if there was anything I wanted to sell or salvage in pursuit of my new telescope.

It seemed popular and elicited some useful feedback, so here is another somewhat rambling look at another part of my current observing kit; eyepieces.  I realized pretty quickly that eyepieces were a huge part of the observing experience.  Like most parts of a telescope, they can work well and disappear into the experience, or they can work poorly and remind you of their frustrating presence all too often.

Before I dive into my eyepiece experiences,  I'll warn its a bit long and can be technical in parts.  This blog is aimed mainly at people who have been observing for a while, so I'm going to assume a bit of eyepiece jargon knowledge.  If you'd like to get up to speed, or need a refresher, you might want to check out Astronomical Telescope Eyepieces: A Discussion for the Beginner.

My Eyepiece Menagerie with the XT8

Brand	Type	MM	Afov	Relief	X Pup	Mag	Tfov
Orion	Plossl	25	50	17	4.23	48	1.04
Orion	Epic ED 2	12.5	55	20	2.11	96	0.57
Orion	Epic ED 2	7.5	55	20	1.27	160	0.34
Teleview	Plossl	32	50	18	5.41	37	1.33
Teleview	Nagler 6	13	82	12	2.20	92	0.89
Teleview	Delos	6	72	20	1.02	200	0.36

If you are looking at the chart above and thinking "This seems a little haphazard" you are right.  They are listed in the order I acquired them and they seem to show an almost studied disregard for planning.  There is a story, and I've learned something from it.

The Story

The first telescope I purchased as an adult was my Orion XT8 dob and it came with the 25mm plossl eyepiece.  I used it for several observing sessions, enjoying the views and getting oriented in they sky again after a long absence.  The 25mm plossl gave pleasing views and was comfortable to use, but it was not long before I felt like I needed some options.  Particularly some higher magnifications for globulars, planetary nebula, and the occasional peek at one our solar system neighbors.

Orion Epic ED2s

After doing a very little bit of research and seeing some positive reviews of the relatively inexpensive ( < $100 ) Orion Epic ED2 eyepieces, I jumped in and purchased two; a 12.5mm and 7.5mm.  These gave me basically 2x and 3.3x times the magnification of the included 25mm plossl with a little more apparent field of view and eye relief.

I debated getting a 2x barlow instead of the 12.5 as it would give me the same magnification as the 12.5mm, and I'm not really sure in retrospect why I did not.  It might be because of the terrible barlow I had when I was a kid.  It really seemed to degrade the view, and with the added inconvenience of another set screw to work in the dark, I just never really seemed to use it.  Every time I purchase a new eyepiece, I think about a barlow, or powermate, instead.  Maybe next time....

The Epic ED2's did provide more options when I was observing, and I did enjoy the higher magnification on globulars and planetary nebula.  Looking back through my observing logs, the 12.5mm seemed to get a bit of use, but I seldom used the 7.5mm.  This is somewhat because I often view extended objects and through my 8" scope they can get pretty dim at high magnification, but I think it was mostly because both were uncomfortable to use, particularly the 7.5mm.

A few online reviews mentioned some issues with 'kidney beaning', darkening of portions of the field if your eye was not in the perfect position relative to the eye lens, but I blithely ignored them.  I had never really seen the effect before, the 25mm plossl was easy to view through, and it did not really sound so bad.  "Okay, so I just look through the eyepiece dead center, no problem at all".

Sadly, this was not as easy as I thought and it was just distracting enough that I found myself avoiding the eyepieces, even when an object probably would have benefited from some more magnification.  I'm not an optical engineer, so I can't really say why one eyepiece with 20mm of eye relief  would exhibit this issue, when another with the same eye relief would not, but these eyepieces seemed positively vexing to view through.  The 12.5mm seemed better in this regard, so it got more use than it's brethren, but even at their comparatively low price point, I felt I was not really getting my money's worth.

Enter Televue

Disenchanted by my experiments at the high end of magnification, I decided to expand my eyepiece collection in the other direction.  There are some great objects, or collections of objects,  that are over the 1 degree field my 25mm plossl provided.  I had also recently purchased my Celestron C6 and, with a longer focal length than my XT8, I wanted something that would provide a wider field.

The C6 has a 1.25" visual back, and I want to be able to share eyepieces as much as possible, so I started looking into the widest true field of view (tfov) 1.25" eyepiece I could get.  After some reading and math, A 32mm plossl seemed like the way to go.  There were some exotic designs that could squeeze a little more tfov out of 1.25", but they were pricey and it seemed like a lot of additional money, complexity, and optical surfaces, to get a very fractional increase.  Besides, I did enjoy the view through my 25mm plossl, and I was a little shy about more exotic designs based on my experience with the ED2's.

I'd read just about everywhere that Televue is the cadillac of eyepiece manufacturers.  Reviews of Ethos' or Naglers abound with tales of life altering views and hefty price tags.  So when I started looking at 32mm plossls I was surprised to see them among the results.  Amazon had them for a bit over $100, and I just happened to have a gift card, so I made the leap.

The eyepiece arrived a few days later and as soon as I opened it I felt good about my purchase.  It was well packaged in a substantial box, and it has the feel of fine craftsmanship.  The knurling was distinct, clean and even, and the text was crisp and easy to read.  These are small touches, but they added up the impression of a long lasting piece of kit.

When I took it out under the stars, the view was great.  It was a very comfortable eyepiece to use, had high contrast and a view as sharp as I had seen through my telescopes.  In short order it became my favorite eyepiece to use in both scopes and the double cluster with the XT8 and the 32mm became one of my favorite targets.

Eyepieces as Investments

My experience with the Televue 32mm plossl on the one hand, and the Orion Epic ED2's on the other, showed me how important an eyepiece is to my overall observing experience.  Since they can be used with any telescope I might own, and can last a lifetime with proper care, I decided I was going to invest in them.  I figured it would take longer for me to fill out my eyepiece case, but I hoped I'd be happy with each and not regret my purchases.

It was about this time that I wished I had more observing friends, or that I was part of an astro-club.  I could only scour reviews and go with my limited experience to decide on which eyepieces I wanted to save up for and purchase.  Looking through a variety of eyepieces owned by other people would have been a wonderful decision making tool.  I've still not joined a local club... something that I need to rectify sometime soon.

Nagler Type 6 13mm

A few months later I had saved up enough money to purchase a Televue Nagler Type 6 13mm.  It seemed like a good next step in magnification, providing a slightly smaller tfov than my 25mm plossl, but with almost double the magnification.  It's also small and light, which I really like.  No balance issues and it's easy to handle in the dark.

The Nagler 13mm has proven to be a spectacular eyepiece.  I really can't say anything negative about it, save for the price.  It seemed high when I purchased it, but it's become a staple of my observing and I never feel it get in the way of what I am viewing.  If there is an object that can take some additional magnification, I never hesitate to switch eyepieces now.  I do wish it was parfocal with the 32mm plossl, and I'm tempted to try some parfocalizing rings to make switching magnifications even easier.

Delos 6mm

To round out my eyepiece set I wanted something about double the magnification of the 13mm Nagler.  My first thought was a 7mm Nagler.  I was really pleased with the 13mm and the small size was attractive compared to other short focal length premium eyepieces.  As I was saving up and contemplating my purchase Televue released their first round of Delos eyepieces.

The Delos are designed for 72 degree, 20 mm eye relief at every focal length.  Early reviews were very good, comparing them very favorably to the legendary Ethos eyepieces, only with a smaller apparent field of view (afov).  As time went on, people posted head to head comparisons with similar focal length Naglers and it was pretty much universal that the Delos offered a better experience for a small (~12%) extra cost.

When I was ready, I spent the extra money and purchased the Delos.  I don't have a similar Nagler to compare it with, but I do find the sharpness and color rendition superior to my 13mm, which is absolutely no slouch!  It's incredibly comfortable to use, and my only issue is the size and weight.

Size Comparison: Delos 6mm, Nagler 13mm, Plossl 32mm

As you can see, it's somewhat of a beast.  Not the largest, or heaviest, eyepiece out there, but compared to the Nagler and Plossl, it's very large.  In the diagonal of my C6 it's almost comical.  Fortunately, I only have balance issues in my dob if I'm observing lower in the sky, and engaging the friction springs on the XT8 generally holds the scope in place.  I'd really like to do a side by side with a 7mm or 5mm Nagler someday just to see if the extra size is worth it.

The Lesson

I've been very happy with my more recent eyepiece purchases.  To me, and my observing experience, they were completely worth the extra money.  It was a learning experience, and I want to apply my lesson to my better telescope project.

My intention is to buy or build a telescope which will last me a long time.  Both in durability, and  usefulness.  I want to be frugal, but ultimately if I don't enjoy the observing experience, it will be a false frugality as I'll just end up purchasing another scope, or replacing cheap parts.

I've already been saving money for a while, and I expect that I'll be saving for a while to come before I can invest in my new telescope.  I'm planning to use that time exploring my options and thinking hard about where the quality/price sweet spot is for each component.  At least when I buy my new telescope, I'll already have some fine eyepieces to use!

Since I've narrowed my better scope down to something in the 14-16" range, I thought it might be interesting to plug a hypothetical 16" f4.5 scope into my eyepiece/telescope spreadsheet to see what I could expect.

My Current Eyepiece Collection with a hypothetical 16" f4.5

Brand	Type	MM	Afov	Relief	X Pup	Mag	Tfov
Teleview	Plossl	32	50	18	5.41	57	0.88
Teleview	Nagler 6	13	82	12	2.20	140	0.58
Teleview	Delos	6	72	20	1.02	304	0.24

Not bad, but eventually I expect to purchase some sort of wide field 2" eyepiece to get me back to a 1+ degree field, and perhaps add a bit more magnification to take advantage of the increased light collection and resolution a 3-4x jump in aperture might afford.

I'd be interested to hear what anyone has to say about their own experiences trying to balance cost and quality.  With plenty of time ahead to think about the issue, I'm sure there is plenty to learn.

Clear Skies!  I'm hoping to get out of the city to take advantage of the new moon.  I hope you can as well.